Nephilum, Giants, Fallen Angels, and Truth (updated, revised)

revised and updated version
this is an abbreviated version for a forth-coming book with even more proofs and why
"we simply cannot make scripture say what it does not say"
-rory moore

This is the condensed version of my book on the same subject.

I wrote an article or two from what I saw written in scripture, and also engaged in numerous debates and discussions, eventually becoming convinced what appeared to be the majority view was not what I read in scripture.

I also noticed a pattern.  The angels/ sons of God/ aliens/ nephilim and some of the UFO crowd all spoke the same thing, made the same assumptions, added the same ideas and often made the scriptures say what they do not say in order to paint a picture of imagination-fired plausibility connecting human genealogy to “extra-terrestrials” or half-human hybrids.

 I want to repeat this phrase for emphasis: 

“they often made the scriptures say what they do not say”. 

And that my friends, is where a “strong delusion” sets in no matter what the subject is about. To refresh our thoughts, here is the passage:

Genesis 6,

1 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of earth ground, and daughters were born to them,

 2 the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and took them wives of all that they chose.

3   And The LORD said, My spirit shall not strive with man forever, for that he also is flesh:  yet shall his days be a hundred and twenty years.
4 The *Nephilim were in the earth in those days,  and also after that, when the sons of God came unto the daughters of men,  and they bare children to them: the same were the mighty men that were of old, the men of renown.

          (*  H5307; properly, a feller,  a bully or tyrant: - giant.)
5   The LORD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth

Let’s use the "sword of the Spirit" to see if we can prove the truth of a commonly accepted doctrine.   This doctrine leads either to or away from the path of scripture into regions of thinking that have us chasing pre-Adamic creation, alien invasions, Adam having two wives, and all sorts of fanciful, unprofitable “learning”.

There are two critical points I would like to test:
1. Does scripture say angels married human wives <daughters of men> ?
2. Does scripture define “sons of God” as angels or men? 

The trouble usually  begins with that phrase in Genesis 6:4, “sons of God”.

WHO are those  “sons of God”? Were they angels or were they men?

Let’s test this:

1. Jesus spoke of men who cannot marry in the resurrection:
  Matthew. 22:29  Jesus said to them, You err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.

  30) For in the resurrection they <i.e. men> neither marry, nor are given in marriage,
but are as angels in heaven.

-Men who achieve the resurrection do not marry, have sexual union, or make babies, because they “are as angels in heaven”.

- But is there written anywhere that angels in heaven married other angels or humans?

- And are angels ever directly named “sons of God”?

Again,  Jesus spoke of angels and sons of God in Luke 20

   34)  and Jesus said to them, The sons of this world marry, and are given in marriage:

   35)   but they that are accounted worthy to attain to that world,  and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage:
   36)   for neither can they die any more: as they are *equal to the angels;
            and are sons of God,  being sons of the resurrection.

*equal to the angels”: G2465 ἰσάγγελος is aggelos “ like an angel, that is, angelic:
- equal to the angels.”

NOTICE: 👉 Jesus said men are sons of God because they were sons of God by the resurrection.
But are *any* angels ever called "sons of God by the resurrection"?
The honest answer is NO.

From what Jesus said above, the Old Testament saints who died in faith, are “equal to angels”,  and who are  "not given in marriage”, as “angels in heaven” are likewise not married,  and they are called  “sons of God” by Jesus, before His resurrection!

Point: In this “sons of God” passage, angels were not included as sons of God by the resurrection even though men are, and men would be as “equal to the angels”. (equal means "like" or as)

In Genesis 6:2 after men multiplied, it says: that the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all that they chose.

But no angels are ever spoken of as married to human wives, and the genealogy's in the Bible bear witness to an absence of angelic paternity. 

Read Jesus' words above very carefully.

Sons of God Error correction #2:

In the Hebrew text, “angels”  are not even mentioned specifically until first mention Genesis 16:7

“And the angel of The LORD found her by a fountain of water in the wilderness”. 

Let’s look at the Hebrew word for “angel”.
  It is “malak”.  (def.: messenger, representative, angel,  the theophanic angel)

Let’s look at the Hebrew word for “sons”.
   It is  “ben” or “bane”.

(son, grandson,  member of a group  son, male child, grandson ,  children (pl. - male and female)  youth, young men (pl.)young (of animals)  sons (as characterization, i.e. sons of injustice [for un- righteous men]or sons of God [for angels]  people (of a nation) (pl.)  of lifeless things, i.e. sparks, stars, arrows)

Yet Jesus said angels do not marry, which was only stated as the union of man and women.

Could these “sons of God” be angels because “ben” has a minor inclusion “sons of God for angels” in the definition?

In scripture, 4,842 times “ben” was used in the Old Testament, but ZERO times translated as “angels” in the ASV, and 0 for 4,906 in the KJV.

Without adding “angels” into any text, not one verse expressly, directly, or specifically speaks of “angels” as sons of God, but it does say that of men.

Therefore the Hebrew language testifies against “sons of God” as  angels.

Next we find in Job the phrase “sons of God” used.

Job 1:6  Now it came to pass on the day when the sons of God came to present themselves

              before the LORD, that Satan also came among them.

      2:1  again it came to pass on the day when the sons of God came to present themselves

              before the Lord, that Satan came also among them to present himself before.

    38:7  when the morning stars sang together, And all the sons of God shouted for joy?

 -Again there is no specific identification that "sons ("ben") of God" were angels (malak).

-“morning stars” can be shown as a metaphor for saints of God and children of Abraham, but I prefer not to insert any metaphor or assumption into the text here.

Now for New Testament "the sons of God" references:

Luke 20:34    Jesus said unto them, The sons of this world marry, and are given in marriage:

Luke 20:36    for neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels;
 and ARE sons of God, being sons of the resurrection.

Now that passage could end the debate, but there are more “sons of God” identified explicitly, directly, and are expressly designated:

Galatians 3:26  For you are all sons of God, through faith, in Christ Jesus.
Ephesians 1:5   having fore-ordained us unto adoption as sons through Jesus Christ...

1Jn 3:2  beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it does not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be LIKE him; for we shall see him as he is.

What we see and do not see in the above scriptures:

-Are any angels, fallen or otherwise directly, specifically  called “sons of God?"   -NO!

-Are the men, “they that are accounted worthy”  called “sons of God”   -YES!

-Are Old Testament saints who were “they of faith”, and “sons of Abraham”,  also “sons of the resurrection” and “accounted worthy” ?      -YES!

Are the same “sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus” called  “sons of God”? -YES!

Did Abraham have faith and look for Jesus? -YES!

Jesus proved it and said “Abraham saw my day and rejoiced”. John 8:56

Now we have two witnesses in Jesus Christ and Witness Paul in agreement telling us who the “sons of God” really are. 

If that were not enough, we see "angels" (aggelos) used 176 times in the New Testament and not one single time are they referred to as "sons" or "sons of God"!

("Aggelos", Gr, #32, "angel(s), messenger(s).

Drilling down:
If that were not enough, "angel(s) are mentioned 74 times in the book of Revelation. 
None are "sons of God" in any context..
"sons of God" as a phrase is used SIX times in the New Testament. Six is the number of man.

Angelic Sons of God Error Corrected, reason number 3:

In scripture, the Word instructs us that a teaching and truth are built “line upon line, line upon line”.

Furthermore, scripture tells us that “in the mouth of two or three witnesses let every word be established”.

The premise that fallen-angels-sons-of-God, were able to make babies in marriage with human women have the following number of verses to additionally witness that theory:

---0--- In all the so and so begat so and so, it is always attributed to humans with the exception of Jesus Christ who was begotten by the Father.

Therefore it is correct, there are no verses in either the Old or New Testaments pointing to women making babies with fallen angels.  

But by way of supposition and assumption ("interpolation", i.e. that is making scripture say what it does not say), is the idea believed.

Jesus did not refer to any “return of the nephilum” as an end time warning about the “days of Noah”.
He DID refer  to signs to watch out for in Matthew 24 and Luke 21, but neither Jesus or Paul wrote of nephilum when warning of “the last days” or end times.

What are the "signs" both Jesus and Paul most warned about?  
-specifically it is "deceivers" "false teachers" "seducing spirits" and "demon doctrines".

Amazing however, there IS a place where Jesus said the devil himself could father children.

Jesus told the Jews and pharisees in  John 8:44 You are of your father the devil,  and the lusts of your father it is your will to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and stands not in the truth, because there is no truth in him.

Do you imagine the fallen arch angel Lucifer-devil have sexual relations with the mothers of the pharisees?

Jesus clearly said they were of their father, the devil.

Question:
 HOW did the devil “father” the pharisees?
-did the devil have sexual relations with Israelite women and how could the devil father human children?

Do you think the devil could have physical sex to impregnate women, make giants, and procreate “nephillum”, that he would have stayed very busy making as many as possible all through history?
-of course we know that is preposterous.
Let's try to discern just how a devil spirit being could be a father of humans.

Here is what Jesus said about "good seed" and "tares" who are of bad seed.
Matthew 13:38 and the good seed, these are the sons of the kingdom;
and the tares are the sons of the evil one

How did tares become "SONS of the evil one"?

Are we are supposed to accept that a one-night stand back there in Genesis 6 by sexy fallen angels, that for some odd reason never again happened in scripture, nor was spoken of as such, nor warned about, is  somehow fit for Christian doctrinal consumption?

No friends, scripture is not of private interpretation.

It is error to isolate one passage and imply a doctrinal precept built around one verse, with no corroborating scripture testimony, and we are building our case for the truth.

Sons Of God Error Corrected Reason 4:

God created “seed” and set into motion a law that said seed would reproduce “after like kind”.

An apple seed brings forth an apple tree. A cows “seed” brings forth cattle-calves.

Angels cannot reproduce with humans.
Angels are not credited with creating life.
Angels ARE called “ministering spirits”, and “a spirit has not flesh and bone” as Jesus said, even though angels have appeared in flesh all through scripture.
1Corinthians 1539 says there IS a body of flesh that is different from earthly flesh.
There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.

Point:  we cannot prove angels have bones, blood, or the internal capacity for sexual reproduction, any or all of which are needed to affirm the theory of angels marrying human women and making babies who became giants.

Seed reproduces kind, and the only seed a seducing spirit can sow is spiritual seed via words, i.e. “doctrines of demons” which are errors and lies.

That was the method of the devil by which deceived Eve in the garden, a demon doctrine deceived her and it was spiritual words that she believed.
A lie is a spiritual seed. By it, humanity was contaminated by a sin nature.

"kind" reproduces like kind. 

24 And God said, Let the earth bring forth living creatures after their kind, cattle,  and creeping things, and beasts of the earth after their kind: and it was so.

25  And God made the beasts of the earth after their kind, and the cattle after their kind, and everything that crept upon the ground after its kind: ...

The phrase "after their kind" created and set order in creation.

There are ZERO scriptures stating that angels (also called spirits) can reproduce flesh.
That which is begotten of the flesh is flesh, that which is of the Spirit is spirit". –John 3:6

WARNINGS:

1Tim 1:3)  As I exhorted thee to tarry at Ephesus, when I was going into Macedonia,  that you might charge certain men not to teach a different doctrine, 4)   neither to give heed to fables and endless genealogies,  which minister questionings....

-You might think the angels are sons of God marrying human women doctrine was in Paul’s mind when he wrote that passage about “endless genealogies” and “which minister questionings” which is so illustrated by the arguments on this subject.

"Fables"  is “muthos”, which is a tale, that is, fiction, (myth).

There are warnings about giving heed to “seducing spirits” and doctrines of demons.

“Seducing spirits” are not about sex with human women, it is their “doctrines” that spiritually impregnate the “sons of God”.

And that is why Jesus told them they were of their father the devil.

Today,  myth and fable are mainstream, and sell well.

But what about the Book of....?
Extra-Biblical books are referenced in scripture itself and many books are written that will take us into other realms based on a Biblical word or phrase.
Yet we are forbidden to establish doctrine apart from scripture, and without additional witness in scripture itself.  I will return to the "What about....?" below.

Sons Of God Error Corrected Reason 5:

Definitively there are simply no scriptures in the New Testament, say anything remotely close to the fallen angels making babies with humans” error, and it is not stated in the references to the angels in Jude and in 2peter 2.

-Are fallen angels ever called “sons of God” in the New Testament?   NO!

-Does the New Testament even mention angels and sonship?   YES!

- ‎"For to which of the angels said He at any time,  You are my Son,  this day have I begotten thee? -Heb 1:5
Can we say *BOOM* ? 
 👉We cannot find anywhere God said to any angel He had "begotten" them and called an angel "son".

Those holding the fallen angels are “sons of God” in Genesis 6 and Job, find themselves directly contradicting God saying to which of his angels at any time did He say “thou art My son”!

Angels are expressly called "spirits".

Heb. 1:13   But of which of the angels has he said at any time, Sit thou on my right hand,

                    Till I make thine enemies the footstool of thy feet?

          14)    Are they not all ministering spirits.

Since angels are spirit-beings:
 Can a fallen angel produce human or angelic sperm in order to impregnate a human woman?

Not according to the law of "after their kind", and not according to Jesus:

John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

"flesh":  The flesh, denotes human nature and the physical substance of human kind.

"spirit": A spirit, i.e. a simple essence, devoid of all or at least all grosser matter,  and possessed of the power of knowing, desiring, deciding, and acting.

A spirit can inhabit a body (as satan entered into Judas), a spirit can appear as a man, but never is a spirit credited with a capability to reproduce human seed or hybrids.

The ONLY seed an evil fallen angel can sow is a lie.

Just because angels materialized into human form and ate food does not mean mean they had every human capability including reproduction. 

The scripture does not state the attribute that  angels can  make human “seed”, and cross breed, as seed begets "kind" after its’ own "kind".

Matthew 13:38 and the good seed, these are the sons of the kingdom;  and the tares are the sons of the evil one”.  That's right, sons of the "evil one" are "tares" because they receive the "seed" of the devil, i.e. lies.

Were "sons of Belial" angels or human?

Some examples of this phrasing is here:
1 Samuel 2:12  Now the sons of Eli were sons of Belial; they knew not the LORD.

1 Samuel 10:27 But the children of Belial said, How shall this man save us?

Deuteronomy 13:13 Certain men, the children of Belial, are gone out from among you, and have withdrawn the inhabitants of their city, saying, Let us go and serve other gods…

Judges 19:22
Now as they were making their hearts merry, behold, the men of the city, certain sons of Belial, ..and spoke to the master of the house, the old man, saying, Bring forth the man that came into thine house, that we may know him.

We ask, if sons of God are fallen angels, and both men and fallen angels are of their father the devil
 then what made both "kind" sons of the devil
 -was it physical procreation or was it spiritual by following a lie and rebellion?
The answer is obvious.

Sons Of God Error Corrected Reason 6:

Warning, fables-fables-fables. "What about the book of..."

Jesus rebuked the Jews "You do err, not knowing the scriptures".
Jesus said in the very passage where He spoke concerning angels, men, and sons of God.

Some folks believe the Book of Enoch is scripture.
However if the Book of Enoch is not verifiable God inspiried scripture, it is not to be included as a witness to a doctrine. -Jesus did not refer to it or quote from it.

In his prophetic writings, Paul did not quote from it.
Jude did write " (v14)  And to these also Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied, saying, Behold, the Lord came with ten thousands of his holy ones.

Did you note that the mention of Enoch’s prophesy is not prefaced “it is written…”?
The prophecy is true because it is given by the Holy Spirit and is written in Jude as a witness, but nowhere do we have confirmation from anyone that “The Book of Enoch” is scripture and it would be witnessed somewhere in scripture if it were.

Quoting a prophesy from Enoch is no different as other words are quoted from many other prophets
The "Book of Enoch" and the writings of Enoch are nowhere validated as scripture, by the scripture.

Contrast that thought.
Isaiah is quoted in the New Testament.
Daniel is quoted in the New Testament.
Moses is quoted in the New Testament.
Other prophets are quoted, and often framed with "as it is written".

Others like Enoch also prophesied likewise:

" And there was also a man that prophesied in the name of Jehovah, Uriah " -Jer. 26:20

".. sons of Asaph, ... who prophesied after the order of the king." 1Chron 25:2

"Of  the sons of Jeduthun: Gedaliah, and Zeri, and Jeshaiah, Hashabiah, and Mattithiah, six, under the hands of their father Jeduthun with the harp, who prophesied in giving thanks and praising Jehovah." 1Chron 25:3

So we see that even though others "prophesied" as Enoch did, the "Book of Enoch" is not given as scripture but a prophesy by Enoch and is witnessed by scripture...

1.  1Timothy 1:4 neither to give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questionings, rather than a dispensation of God which is in faith; so do I now.

2.   2Timothy 4:4 and will turn away their ears from the truth, and turn aside unto fables.

3.  Titus 1:14 not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men who turn away from the truth.      (bad fruit turns God's people away from scripture)

4.  2Peter 1:16 For we did not follow *cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord 

Jesus Christ… ( *cunningly means to continue in PLAUSIBLE ERROR…)

Once the unvarnished truth is accepted,  the doctrine of hormone-driven sexy angels marrying or sexually molesting women and making babies who become giants is shown to be absurd and ridiculous.

Because doctrine is not to be established by one verse, one context, or assuming scripture means what it does not say.
A true doctrine is established "line upon line..." with mutually supporting scripture.

I submit to you, the reader, that no scripture states that angels are "sons of God", but scriptures do say that men are called "sons of God'.

I submit that in no other passage of scripture is there reference to, or a declaration of angelic spirits having sexual relations with human women and making babies.

I submit to you that God repeats history and we can demonstrate that in the scripture.
 But I cannot find any repetition of God repeating the alleged "sons of God-fallen angel" theory of them making babies with humans they married.
I submit that Jesus never said or alluded to that in the season of His return, as in the days of Noah, that there would be "a return of the Nephilim".

In closing, there are scriptures that cannot lie, but men can be deceived into lying about them. 

Read them with care and decide for yourself.

...   the Nephilim were in the earth in those days, and also after that,
when the sons of God came unto the daughters of men,

...   neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are sons of God, being sons of the resurrection

...   For unto which of the angels said he at any time,  Thou art my son ?

*** Further scripture notes on “Sons of God”:

If "sons" of God means or included "angels", then there is not a single evidence of that in these passages which specifically and expressly mention "sons" of God:

Exodus 4:22 And thou shalt say unto Pharaoh, Thus saith the LORD, Israel is my son

Deut 32:19          And the Lord saw it, and abhorred them, Because of the provocation of his sons and his daughters

John 1:12     But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God even to them that believe on his name:

1Chron 17:13 (of Solomon) I will be his father, and he shall be my son: and I will not take my mercy away from him

1 Chron 22:10 He shall build an house for my name; and he shall be my son, and I will be his father

Hosea 11:1 When Israel was a child, then I loved him, and called my son out of Egypt.

Rev  21:7 He that overcomes shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.

How does one become "a son of God"?
Did OT saints “overcome by faith?

Did they believe God?

Did they “see from afar” the promises of God in Christ?

Were they sons of God by the resurrection?

God tells us:

Isaiah 43:6 I will say to the north, Give up; and to the south, Keep not back: bring my sons from far, and my daughters from the ends of the earth;

Isaiah 45:11 Thus says the LORD, the Holy One of Israel, and his Maker, Ask me of things to come concerning my sons,  and concerning the work of my hands command ye me.

2Cor. 6:18 And will be a Father to you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, said the Lord Almighty.

Hebrews 11 tells us who the “sons of God by FAITH in Christ Jesus” were:

4 By faith Abel 5 By faith Enoch 7 By faith Noah,8 By faith Abraham

13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them and greeted them  from afar

24  By faith Moses... 26  accounting the reproach of Christ greater riches

Galatians 3:26 For ye are all sons of God, through faith, in Christ Jesus.

Romans 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God.

Luke 20:36 for neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels;  and are sons of God, being sons of the resurrection.

Not once are angels “sons” in any of those passages..

Genesis 3:15 and I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed: he shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

Should we accept that both the woman and the serpent have "seed", and that the serpent was the devil,

both are prophesied to have "seed", in Hebrew meaning ones posterity.

Since both would have a "posterity", did the devil continue to have human children through sexual reproduction? -or would his children be those that received the same lie, and have the same nature as the serpent??
 -just as the pharisees who were called children of the devil.

-The woman's "seed" is recognized as Jesus who would come to bruise the "head" of satan.

Luke 6:35 But love your enemies, and do them good, and lend, never despairing; and your reward shall be great, and you shall be sons of the Most High

..............

I noticed that NONE of the angels mentioned in scripture such as Michael and Gabriel, are ever specifically called "sons of God", not in any passage in the entire Bible!!

Can you find non-human "sons of God here?

Deuteronomy 32:19 And The LORD saw it, … Because of the provocation of his sons and his daughters.

Judges 5:5  And the children of Israel dwelt among the Canaanites, the Hittites, and the Amorites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites:
( the children of Israel WERE called “sons of God”)

6 and they (the sons of God,-Israel)  took their daughters (of pagan men) to be their wives, (as married to the Israeli sons of God)   and gave their own daughters (the children of Israel)  to their sons  (of men) and served their gods.

Let's think, do these include angels as sons of God?

Isaiah 43:6  I will say to the north, Give up; and to the south, Keep not back; bring my sons from far, and my daughters from the end of the earth

2 Corinthians 6:18  And I will be to you a Father, And you shall be to me sons and daughters, says the Lord Almighty.

Why is there no commandment in the word of God for man not to cohabitate with angels?

When God warned against intermarriage with parents and family members in the law, and severely warned of adulterous marriages, and warned against sex with animals, and warned against homosexual sex, and warned about marriage with unbelievers, and warned against unmarried sexual relations, He did not give warning against marriage or sex with fallen angels. 

There is*nothing* in the New Testament in regard to angels making babies with humans but there is repeated warnings regarding immorality and fornication among humans.
Since no angels are ever directly called “sons of God”, and since no scripture witnesses that angels can  or did marry human women and make babies, we categorically reject this teaching and pray the Lord will open the eyes of those who are driven to contend for it.

We simply cannot “go beyond that which is written” and try to make the scripture say what it does not say, even if the arguments seem plausible.

Copyright 2014 by Rory Moore 

The simple Rapture Timing Truth

The simple Rapture Timing Truth

Let’s begin with two of the most direct and specific textual pillars used by the “pre-trib” advocates.

Question: Is this the “rapture” here in 1Corinthians 15?

42)   So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown a perishable body, it is raised an imperishable body; …….51)  Behold, I tell you a mystery: We all shall not sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52)   in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound,
        and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

and is THIS also the rapture in 1 Thess?

1Thess. 4:13 But we would not have you ignorant, brethren, concerning them that fall asleep; that ye sorrow not, even as the rest, who have no hope.

14)   For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also that are fallen asleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
15)   For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we that are alive, that are left unto the coming of the Lord, shall in no wise precede  them that are fallen asleep.
16)   For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven, with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God:
===> and the dead in Christ shall rise >>> first<<<

17 then we that are alive, and remain, shall together with them (the dead in Christ) be caught up in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

It is all about the "pre-trib"rapture they say, correct?

RESURRECTION:  Anastasis Strongs 386 def: a raising up, a rising from the dead , that of Christ that of all men at the end of this present age the resurrection of certain ones history who were restored to life

Perhaps you just noticed the mention of “them that are fallen asleep” (-them that have died in Christ),  precedes the phrase  “caught up in the clouds”.
The resurrection of the dead is the raising up of our physical bodies which “sleep” in physical death.
 ( the spirit of a saint is with the Lord, only our physical body sleeps. Jesus modeled this in His death when His physical body was in the tomb, His spirit was in Paradise releasing the saints. When Jesus rose from the dead, his body was transformed when his spirit re-entered it.)

The raising of the dead (our physical bodies) is mentioned throughout Old and New Testaments:

Job 19: For I know that my redeemer lives, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth: And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God:
Luke 20:37  But that the dead are raised, even Moses showed, in the place concerning the Bush

Luke 20:35          But they that are accounted worthy to attain to that world, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage
John 11:24          Martha said to him, I know that he (Lazarus)  shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.

The “FIRST” RESURRECTION  immediately precedes the gathering to Christ.

-as stated in the supposed “pre-trib rapture” verses in 1Thess. 4 up above (read them again).

The “pre-trib” rapturists believe Christians will escape martyrdom, the “mark of the beast”, and the events of “great tribulation but let’s set these in order.

Now that we have shown that them that are asleep in Christ are raised immediately before those that are alive and remain to the coming of the Lord, and that the dead are raised in the resurrection on the “last day”…………….

Here is the simple truth:

Rev. 20:4   And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them:
 === > and I saw the souls of them that had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus
and for the word of God, and such as worshipped not the beast, neither his image, and received not the mark upon their forehead and upon their hand;
and they lived, and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

5 …….. This is the first resurrection.
The rest of the dead lived not until the thousand years should be finished.
6)   Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection
over these the second death hath no power; but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

The first resurrection  of  “them that are fallen asleep” that is near simultaneous with the "harpazo" of 1Thess. 4 and 1Cor. 15  is in Rev 20 and includes the martyred tribulation saints!

There is not a 2nd resurrection of beheaded saints after the tribulation because the dead in Christ rose first at the supposed “pre-trib” rapture! There is not a "FIRST resurrection" part 1 and 2.

The "first resurrection” includes those refusing the mark and the martyrs.
 If the “first resurrection” is before the tribulation, then the “first resurrection” that includes martyred saints who refused the mark cannot be first because the first rising of “them that are asleep” were raised before the “first resurrection”.

Therefore there can be no pre-trib rapture. In the "rapture" the "dead in Christ rise "first" just as the dead in Christ that refused the mark are raised together in the "first" resurrection...

This is the simple unmovable truth and the "first resurrection".
No lie is of the truth. The "pre-trib rapture" is not true and our prayer is the Lord will open your eyes to the truth and deliver you from the writers and sellors of the pre-trib rapture error...

The Narrow Way of Ministery According to Jesus

About 33 AD

And today, Circa 2014 A.D.

There is an amazing contrast from the weekly pulpit ministry of today and Jesus.
As Jesus achieved some fame they sought to kill him.  But the suited Sunday orators bear little resemblance to the meek and humble Jesus Christ of Scripture. 

The temptation of Jesus bears mention, who tempted Jesus with the highest position in the building?

Matthew 4:5 (NLT)

5 Then the devil took him to the holy city, Jerusalem, to the highest point of the Temple…

Do you think there were no people around to see the potential miracle and show?

Contrast with the popular, author-pastor who literally filled Dodger Stadium in Los Angeles in April 2010 with a huge crowd. 

 And we read how the devil took Jesus to the high place in God's temple building that his disciples described in : Mark 13:1 - And as he went out of the temple, one of his disciples said to him, Master, see what manner of stones and what buildings are here!" 

You see, Jesus could have jumped and put on a great show to impress the crowd below.
-But no,  it was not deliverance from the temptation of suicide that was being offered, it was the temptation to use worldly means to gain recognition..
Every time His disciples or followers tried to take him and promote Him in the eyes of man, Jesus hid Himself.

 John 6:15 - When Jesus then perceived that they would come and take him by force to make him a king, he departed again into a mountain alone.."

 Rather than seeking fame and a large "ministry", Jesus did not use self-promotion so commonly practiced in the church world. Yet even His own family urged Him to advertise and promote His ministry!!

John 7:3-5 (NLT)
³ and Jesus’ brothers said to him, “Leave here and go to Judea, where your followers can see your miracles!

 ⁴ You can’t become famous if you hide like this! If you can do such wonderful things, show yourself to the world!” 

 That's right,  His own carnal "brethren" were all for Jesus using worldly means to promote His "message".  

Why did they think in terms of using worldly promotion
The next verse says: "For neither did his brethren believe in him." 

-And neither do these self-promoters with their body guards, "faith partners", telethons, appeals for support, and laying up of their treasures here on earth contrary to what Jesus spoke. They are preaching "another Jesus" as Paul warned.

Notice how Jesus refused opportunity:
Matthew 8:4 - And Jesus said to him, See thou tell no man; but go thy way, show yourself to the priest, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, for a testimony unto them.
Mark 7:36 - And he charged them that they should tell no man
Mark 8:26 -  he sent him away to his house, saying, Do not go into the town, nor tell it to any in the town.
Mark 8:30 - And he charged them that they should tell no man of him.
Mark 9:9 - And as they came down from the mountain, he charged them that they should tell no man what things they had seen, till the Son of man were risen from the dead.
Luke 8:56 - And her parents were astonished: but he charged them that they should tell no man what was done.

Compare Jesus with many famous present day representatives of Christianity today:
John 7:18 - He that speaks of himself seeks his own glory: 
John 5:41   I do not receive honor from men.
John 5:43   if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

How we honor the great orators and pretty faces in our day!
But Jesus warned:

John 5:44 "How can ye believe, when you receive honor one of another, and seek not the honor that comes from God only?" 

In our church experience it became nauseating to hear the flowery, men-honoring introductions of visiting preachers. And usually those well paid speakers would in turn pay flattery tribute to the pastor. In our old denomination the pastor was exalted and I remember testimonies of the glory of pastor's life and ministry.

 Did you notice how Jesus pointed out the religious leaders would get honor from each other and this would hinder their ability to believe His Word?  

Notice the way of Jesus in John 5:13 (ASV): But the man who was healed did not know who healed him,  as JESUS HAD SLIPPED AWAY while there was a crowd in that place".

Surely Jesus missed a golden opportunity  for showmanship in the style of countless other "name brand" ministries of today.  What Jesus could have done was taken that fella by the hand and skipped him around the temple a few times so folks would know the healer was in the house.

If He wore a tailored, white, Italian made Jewish robe, had body guards, and Gucci sandals, could He quickly attract a vast following?

But He also missed a chance to give a 50 minute sermon to proclaim his "vision for the church" too, and especially the chance to receive some tithes and offerings from the great crowd in the place in order to finance His ministry. 

He was completely unlike the preachers who rarely pass an opportunity for a bit of "seed sowing" from the folks.  Elaborate church platforms and lighting bear witness to who is seeking the attention of the crowd.

-Acts 8:9 But there was a certain man, called Simon, which before in the same city used sorcery, and bewitched the people of Samaria, giving out that himself was some great one: 

10 To whom they all gave heed, from the least to the greatest, saying, This man is the great power of God. 

11 And to him they had regard, because that of long time he had bewitched them with sorceries

13 Then Simon himself believed also: and when he was baptized, he continued with Philip..when Simon saw that through laying on of the apostles' hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money

19 Saying, Give me also this power.. 20 But Peter said unto him, Thy money perish with thee, because thou hast thought that the gift of God may be purchased with money".

Yet today the modern merchants of Babylon have an industry in Christianity selling "anointed" cloths, Holy Spirit Crusades, Books on "blessings", CD's and syllabus’s, impartation, conferences.... the list is endless.  22 Repent therefore of this thy wickedness... -Peter told Simon when he wanted to buy a ministry.

In 3 John :9 another character is mentioned illustrating what happens to a man who is lifted up: 

"I wrote unto the church: but Diotrephes, who loves to have the preeminence among them, received us not.  

Simply put , Diotrephes was a  man in charge of a church that loved his position.
"Preeminence" is defined: Superior to or notable above all others; to stand out .  That one verse should give a serious heart-check for hidden motives.

      

Acts 20:30 gives another clue:  "Also of your own selves (ministers) shall men arise (be lifted up), speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples to follow after themselves". (making followers of their ministry (teachings-ideas, and words)  

Whose disciples are we/ Who do we seek to emulate?

            Rev. 2:14   "But I have a few things against you, because you have (in the church) them that hold the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balac to set a stumblingblock in front of the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed to idols, and to commit fornication.

The Lord brought  mention of both Balaam and the doctrine of the Nicolaitanes in forceful terms in this passage.  Let's see if we can apply this word to modern ministry.  Balaam, a messenger and servant of God sold out for personal gain and was impressed by the gifts and status of the men Balak sent to him. "And Balak sent yet again princes, more, and more honorable...".
Balaam was drawn away from obedience to God by his respect of persons that flattered him, and God tested his heart..     

The Christian "stars" and celebrities of this present world are the idols of God's people.  So often too is the local pastor people seek to follow and promote as the voice of God.

Those who build the visible, man-made kingdoms of "the earth" certainly appear to fill the warnings given to "beware of false prophets".   Put them in their "temples" and you have God's people following them preferring their words and ministries in place of personal study and prayer. 

And the people still continue to bring their gifts, sacrifices, and offerings to the modern idols of stone and wood called "churches".

Compare the manner and ministry of Jesus, Paul, and the believers in Acts, see an honest picture of what real Christian ministers look like. And there is not one flashy, self-promoting, self-serving, glorified one in the bunch. Period. 

Sadly, it is God's people who magnify and enable these men to become the spiritual giants they are. And God forgive us for the "glory-to-the-pastor" testimonies and blind loyalty cultivated in our churches.

 Drawing close to God's Word and Spirit will enable us to take the sword of the Spirit and cut off the head (leadership and influence) of these religious giants so Christ can reign in us.

Jesus Who? ??? Call Him What?

?

Call Him Jesus?

by Rory Moore

If we did not already have confusion in Christianity today, there seems to be a growing number of Christians, or should we say Yahoshuans, Yeshuans, or Christianos that put forth an interesting array of apellations for the Saviour.
Jeshua, Yeshua, Yeshuah, Yehshua, Yehshuah, YESHUA, YESHUAH, YEHSHUA, YEHSHUAH, Yeshouah, Y'shua, Y'shuah, Jeshu, Yeshu, Yehoshua, Yehoshuah, YHVHShua, YHVHShuah, Yhvhshua, Yhwhshua, YHWHShua, YHWHShuah, Yhvhshuah, Yhwhshuah, Yahvehshua, Yahwehshua, Yahvehshuah, Yahwehshuah, Jahshua, Jahshuah, Jashua, Jashuah, Jahoshua, Jahoshuah, Jehoshua, Jehoshuah, Yashua, Yashuah, Yahshua, Yahshuah, YAHSHUA, YAHSHUAH, YASHUA, YASHUAH, Yahushua, Yahoshua, Yahoshuah, Yaohushua, YAOHUSHUA,  Iahoshua, Iahoshuah, Iahushua, or Iahushuah?? 

Now while there are various spellings and pronunciations, sometimes folks can slip into the  legalistic side of how we call on the Savior. (and He still shows up!)

I culled a few variations from a number of sources: Yahshua YESHUA Yeshua Adonai Yeshua HaMashiach Iesous Ieshoua yehÖshÙa yehoshua Y'SHUA Yĕhowshua YAHUSHUA came from someone correcting me. Yahusha "Yahusha and this Yahweh? That's a mistransliteration of G-D's name! The word is meaningless! .. “Yeshua is not the Hebrew name of Jesus. It would be Yeshai" -was seen on a YouTube post. and from a FaceBook post: "YAHUWSHUWA" ... can also we spell c-o-n-f-u-s-i-on?

If you are Japanese, He is YaeSu Nim; in Tamil, YaeSu Nim; in Fiji, Jisu;  or in Russia: Иисус Христос, -Iisus Khristos, A Serbian calls on ISUS, a Slovakian Jezis.

Why do we need to make such a simple thing so complicated?
If you are reading this, God bless you, I sincerely mean no insult or offense to anyone from any of the various camps. Folks go to verbal fighting over their pet version and Jesus saves no matter what language you speak. 

There are a lot of people named in the Bible, why stop with only another translation version of Jesus?    Here is a list in Romans of NAMES of saints:
Rom. 16:
8  Ampliatus...
9  Urbanus... and Stachys my beloved.
10 Apelles... the household of Aristobulus.
11 Herodion...  Narcissus...
12  Tryphaena and Tryphosa.. Salute Persis....
13  Rufus ....
14  Asyncritus, Phlegon, Hermes, Patrobas, Hermas...
15  Philologus and Julia, Nereus and his sister, and Olympas, and all the saints 

And do not forget Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Timothy, Titus, Paul, Peter,  Philomen, Cornelius, Dorcas, and others.

Hopefully, you will see some humor in this exercise by now. 

The chances are very good that if you are reading and understanding these words it is because you read and understand English no matter what your ancestry might be.  And if you are the typical American Christian, you probably read and believe in the Bible Scriptures that you read in English, even if we get a bit tongue tied over some of the Biblical names.

One lady told me how she had become confused of how to address God in prayer because of the variations of Jesus' name.  SAD! 

Well I hope many of us take comfort in the fact that even though some of us do not read Hebrew, Aramaic, Latin, or Greek, the truth of Scripture is not limited or hindered by our lack of ability to read and/or speak those languages. 

If you are Latino, God bless you in the name of Jesus (Hay-soos) Christo.If you are from Alabama and speak with a Southern accent, Jesus saves.
If you are praying and in need, calling on "JEEE-sus", or it comes out sounding like "JeSUS!", fear not.  God hears and answers our cry.

Years ago, before religion got to me, in repentence and brokeness, I called on to Jesus to save me.  HE did, and my life was changed by Him from that day forward.  No, the Lord did not send someone over to correct the sylables I had uttered or instruct me in the Hebrew, Latin, or Greek pronounciation.  I just started reading the Bible and prayers answered when I asked in Jesus' name.

Later, as a Holy Spirit baptized believer, I began to experience healing and the casting out of demons through the Name of Jesus.
Yes, people were healed, saved, and delivered all through the name of Jesus that I read about in my Bible. Praise the Lord JESUS.    

There is absolutely no irreverence or disrespect in this writing, nor is it meant as a slap to any of our Jewish brethren that choose to call on "Yeshua" or the like. What God did for me through Jesus, He will do for a Jewish believer in Yehoshua, or a Latino who calls on "Hey-soos Christo". 

The point is why get hung up over the correct pronunciation  from a language you don't even speak?

Some of the contenders go as far as saying Jesus was really Zeus, the Greek pagan god.
That is sheer RIDICULOUS and absurd.  

God ordained the New Testament to be written in Greek,
Over 911 times it was spelled in the Greek form IESOUS, as a Greek lexicon will prove.

Even though Jesus is rooted in the Hebrew Old Testament, the New Testament never gave us the Hebraic form, so relax.  
Even when Old Testament verses are quoted in the New Testament, they are in the Greek language.

What is most important is that you read God's Word in the language you understand, and call on Jesus in your language in faith knowing that God hears you.

 If you are an English speaker, I assure you devils are cast out in Jesus' name, lives changed, healings and miracles are done. When we pray, God hears and answers, in Jesus name.When we read our English KJV, ASV, NKJV, NASV, or even the NIV, there is no need to stumble over the English version of Jesus on the printed page, the same is true for a Chinese, Korean, or Russian Christian reading their translated version of the Name of Jesus. God still hears and answers.
Here it is in Greek: Ihsou=v The Transliterated Word  Phonetic Spelling
  Iesous     ee-ay-sooce' 

May Jesus Christ, the Son of the Living God, the Messiah, the Savior, deliver us from un-necessary strife over syllables, vowels, and silliness. 

Our Journey and a word about who we are (and were)

About us as we are about Him. Me: (Rory Moore) came to the Lord in 1979 at the age of 28 and married Linda in 1983. We have three children. For 24 years Linda and I were in our church "inner circle" and doing almost everything you can do in a church without turning "pro".  In 24 years I served as an Assistant Pastor, Youth Leader, licensed minister, Elder, Board member, preacher, teacher,  fund raiser, altar worker, deacon, building maintenance, counselor, home and hospital visitation minister and we were financial pillars to the church in every way via tithing, offerings, fund raisers and more. I guess we were typical, average loyal church supporters.  We also worked closely with all of our pastors and leadership and had many friends in ministry, in the local church scene, and with other fellowship circles. -long before the internet.  Linda was Choir Director for 7 years, a "special" singer, Sunday School teacher, church secretary treasurer, fund-raiser worker, and did many "helps".  We were faithful attendees of almost every service and function of the church. For two decades we were among the first to arrive and were among the very last to leave church services and were often there 2-4 hours on those days, plus staff meetings.  We had 4 meetings per week including 2x on Sunday, Wed., and Friday evening; then as we morphed over the years, two regular services per week.  The decline in church gathering and prayer took place after we incorporated into a 501c3 organization.  As the years went by, we did not notice the progressive decline away from the scriptures and prayer as we stayed busy with church programs, activities, and the routine of church life. This decline occurred as our church transitioned from a denominational Pentecostal church into a non-denominational Evangelical Christian community church.  In 2004 in the wake of two events, a family crisis and the passing of my dad, in my grief and sorrow, I sought the Lord fervently and returned to regular and prayerful study of the Bible. After "praying through" to a spiritual renewal, I asked the Lord for deeper understanding about our tithe doctrine after noticing a verse in Nehemiah 13:5 that said how the "singers" were given tithes! Linda was Choir Leader and therefore shouldn't she be getting tithes? (The Pastor received all tithes in our church). When I showed that to Pastor, he looked at me with a funny expression on his face and mumbled a few words I do not recall. He had no answer. It struck me as strange singers and doorkeepers were to receive tithes. So I asked the Lord to show me the truth about this, and the Lord spoke to me clearly "start reading the New Testament." "OK", and as I did, He began showing me verses overlooked, what tithing was under the law, and that ministers were expected to work and be examples of giving. I kept thinking, "ok, I will surely read verses to confirm our church tithe teachings at some point in reading." A few weeks later it came as a shock when I realized there was no direct instruction to any Christians or churches that they were to pay tithes!  (this was before I later discovered that Biblical tithes were never monetary). I literally thought I was losing my mind. How could everyone I knew be wrong? But I simply could not find monetary tithing given to any church or saint in scripture as New Testament!  Too sensitive a subject to discuss? Mentioning this to a few others about my questions only brought an attempt to "correct" us in the form of a surprise visit from the pastor and other elders one Monday night.  When I attempted to question tithing in front of the elders, the subject was immediately shut down by Pastor and no questioning was permitted in front of us elders. I saw through the deceit and never went back, although we did go visit other churches. (not because God led us to, but it was a 24 year habit). We never dreamed of leaving our church but on Sept. 29, 2004, but after weeks of wrestling with this decision, we walked away from the 501c3 church we helped to start in 1993 as founding members. As typical middle-of-the-road Christian role models of the sincere church going family for 24 years, we realized we now had to leave the church in order to find God all over again. Starting over with Jesus. So after more than 3,500 church services, staff meetings, revivals, and related gatherings, we walked out into the unknown.       It was very difficult, as not once in 24 years had we ever left our church. But The Lord began to confirm these things through others, in a multitude of dreams,  and we were seeing many things in Scripture  we had not noticed or overlooked.  The Lord God became our Shepherd.  As He revealed more of Himself to me, the Lord told me to "Write" and we now minister to far more people through writing and ministering the Word of God -and we are glad to do so gladly and freely.  Writing the book, "The Tithe That Binds"  was the off-shoot of my personal study and questioning the Lord on the subject of tithing. When the book was in the writing stage, at one point I sought the Lord for the title as I wanted HIM to name it.  For three days we prayed for a title and on the third day, He gave us the name of it, and He also provided a Christian publisher who worked and gave of her time to us freely in order to publish it. A second revised edition is forthcoming, expanded and further building on the truths regarding what the scripture does or does not say about monetary tithing. Link:https://docs.google.com/document/d/1_QEoDsSUC_N-uwT-2p9lwm-QfXf4sqyY6azRFrJFiog/edit?usp=sharing I have several more books to publish such as "Who are God's Chosen People", The Giants, Nephilium, and Truth", Preterism?, and "WHO ARE YOU LORD?" according to the preaching by the disciples in Acts after they were Spirit filled. At this point, 2022, we are 18 years out of "Institutional" Christianity and enjoying fellowship with other ministers and saints who have also come out of the system.  It took us more than two years of "de-churching" and un-learning what we had  been taught from men, in order to learn and be taught from God's Word.  In order to learn from God we had to be willing to unlearn what we learned from men. -which is what Jesus taught but the churches do not. The Bible is a wonderful and amazing book and has become a beacon of truth to us as we seek to do what it says rather than what others say it says...

Flattering Titles, Sacred Cows, High Horses

Flattering Titles, Sacred Cows, High Horses and by-passing sacred scripture By rory moore, a brother "Good morning and welcome everyone one, God bless you! I am  Senior Pastor, Dr. V.A. Nity.   We are honored and privileged today to have as our special guest speaker, Bishop C.M. Proud,  D.D./PhD, Chief Apostle and President of the Worldwide Association of Mainstream Ministries."   -"Thank you Dr. Nity, it is a great honor to be with you, your staff, and the congregation today .... Your Music Pastor Ken Olie and Choral Director Bobbie-Jo, did a wonderful job in the Song Service and we want to compliment Deacon Jones who worked to provide us with such generous hospitality."  What you just read takes place in an unlimited number of variations, depending upon who the players are, in pulpits around the world every Sunday morning.  How quickly and easily these typical flowery introductions go in one ear and out the other of the typical congregant. Incredibly, that nice introduction and response by-passed the very words of the Bible those eloquent men desire to represent. We mind-numbed church goers just smiled, clapped, and nodded at smiling men in suits up there on the platform, some wishing deep inside they could be up there getting the accolades too. We all watched with anticipation what stirring words of profound wisdom might be forthcoming from our Titled speaker.  Little did we or anyone in the auditorium realize we had just steam-rolled some admonishments of scripture!  1.  Job 32:21 Let me not, I pray you, accept any man's person,                      neither let me give flattering titles unto man. 2.  Job 32:22 For I know not to give flattering titles                      in so doing my maker would soon take me away.  Now that is a waker-upper to the Doctor of Divinity Bible College mills, Para-Church Ministries, card-carrying "Apostles", Senior Pastors, Bishops, and Denominational hierarchies.  Do you think a man like the apostle Paul may have had those scripture verses in mind when he wrote in 1 Thessalonians 2:5?  "For neither at any time used we flattering words, as ye know, nor a cloke of covetousness; God is witness".     As we searched for the meaning of "flattering", we found in the Hebrew, kânâh; to address by an additional name;  hence, to eulogize: - give flattering titles, surname (himself).  According to scripture, in lauding and titling ourselves and others, we have brought harm and hurt to the Body of Christ. Prov. 29:5 says  A man that flatters his neighbor spreads a net for his steps.  This simply means that the lifting up of men (and women) with Titles (surnames and additions to their name) causes them to be snared by exaltation. Have you seen how Jesus taught on this same subject in Matt. 23? Rather than seeking to please the crowds, inflate their own ego, or feed their own self-esteem, both Jesus and the disciples utterly forsook the ego-centric outward appearances of success so common in today's church world.  Not only did we toss honorific flattering titles and positions around our churches, but we had our  own well-paid prophets come around call forth great "visions" for our future to go with them.  "But we must "HONOR them that labor" among us, the Bible says...... "  Are you ready once again to have your mind changed and your theology tweaked?  "Honor" is used in several forms often in the New Testament, none of which legitimatize the use of flattering titles which tend to inflate egos and enhance the perception carnal authority:  Here is a little word study from the Lexicon. G1784    valued,: - dear, more honorable, precious, in reputation. G5091   fix the value   to honor, to have in honor, to revere, venerate G5092    a value, that is, money paid, valuables; by analogy esteem (especially of the highest degree), or the dignity itself: - honor, precious, price, some. to prize, that is, fix a valuation upon;  by implication to revere: - honor, value  Now you can "plug-in" the actual meaning with the general term "honor" in the verses below.   Eph 6:2  Honor g5091 thy father and mother (which is the first commandment with promise),  Phil 2:29  Receive him therefore in the Lord with all joy; and hold such in honor: g1784  1Thes 4:4   that each one of you know how to possess himself of his own vessel in sanctification and honor, g5092  1Timothy 1:17   Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only God, be honor g5092 and glory forever and ever. Amen.  1Tim 5:3   Honor  g5091 widows that are widows indeed.  To "honor"  has everything to do with "to prize, value, consider precious, dear", etc. in the context of Christian love, than it does to flattering titles and flowery speeches and financial reward!  If your Bible is to be believed and followed, "flattering titles" have a role in causing God's people to stumble. The fact that New Testament writers and Jesus Himself never sought "glory from men", or had "respect of persons" testifies to yet another area where visible Christianity has fallen away from the humility of the Gospel.  We are not making "sin" out of the wearing of church titles. We are pointing out some scriptures that address the Titles and the motives for them. Again, read what Jesus taught about them in Matthew 23 in addition to what is here, and you will understand why some have chosen not to take titles as we minister.  The apostles forsook the trappings and Titles of the religious crowd. Paul called himself “AN apostle” in all of his epistles. Peter the same. In Acts there was no salutations made using Titles because they obeyed Jesus’ instructions in Matthew 20 and 23. When Luke wrote Acts, he did not use Titles for any of the apostles, prophets, teachers, or brethren that are mentioned there.  And that is the simple truth. What people do with it is between them and the Lord.